Contents Information Events and Results Gymnasts Archive
Contents Archive Archive

Message board

Welcome to the new RSG.net message board! Please behave!
Please remember, that the message board is not responsible for the opinions expressed by its members.
Also don't insult, blame, accuse, discriminate, or debase other people here.
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Bessonova's clubs analysis 2008- Beijiing
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Rhythmic Gymnastics Forum Index » Code of Points
View previous topic | View next topic  
Author Message
noob_lover



Joined: 06 Sep 2008
Posts: 89

PostPosted: Sat, 13-Sep-2008 6:41    Post subject: Reply with quote

i have no idea what are you talking about
but so am i say with you :Thank You
Smile Bounce
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Marts85



Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Posts: 634
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Sat, 13-Sep-2008 15:47    Post subject: Reply with quote

sofia wrote:
Tahnee wrote:
Am I the ONLY one who thinks Bessonova's scores were actually right, and the Russians were just overscored???


me too.....except her clubs....all the other scores were fine.


i agree with you
_________________
And she stood in that regal, yet beautifully defiant, pose and waited for her music to start.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
CoCoNuTsiopatHic



Joined: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 821

PostPosted: Sat, 13-Sep-2008 22:59    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow! I am sorry, but this week I unexpectedly had to go without internet access until now and couldn't return to post an analysis of Kanaeva's clubs routine to go along with the one I did for Bessonova. But I assure you all from the bottom of my heart that I have nothing but love for Bessonova! From the beginning the Olympic Games it was my biggest wish to see her win that gold medal! I would happily contribute an analysis of any other gymnast to prove that I am not biased against Bessonova.

I am still interested in knowing how this has been communicated that no more than 7.0 of CAP may be written on the judging form. I cannot find anything in the 2007 English Code of Points or any of the Newsletters that dictate this.

I'll have an analysis for Kanaeva ready as soon as I can get to it.
_________________
*Elegance is an attitude.*
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Eulucil



Joined: 11 Sep 2008
Posts: 524
Location: Spain

PostPosted: Sun, 14-Sep-2008 1:02    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crazy_fan wrote:
Storm wrote:
IH has been kind to use "dancing"... she was not surely referring at Alina expressivity, be sure.


Well, she wasn't dancing and she wasn't sitting on the carpet doing nothing. Wink
She did some elements and someone counted them for something. That someone being the judges...


Yes, most of the times she was running after the hoop... Laughing Never mind, it was only a joke. I think that Bessonova "only" has a 9 written in her DV form, but that's because she only writtes elements that she can perform properly, Don't forget that gymnastics is more than a difficulty value, a routine needs also good execution and artistry, and many of russian top gymnasts' routines lack these basic components. I can't say who deserves to win when two gymnasts perform well, but when one of them has serious mistakes, I think that everybody is clever enough to notice it.
Patras 2007 - Kapranova 3rd with several drops and other mistakes
Moscow 2006 - Kabaeva second with an erratic ball routine and a rope out of the carpet
Baku 2005 - I couldn't see the all arround competition Laughing
I'm not disappointed with Beijing podium, because Anna had mistakes in hoop, but her clubs score...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Tahnee
RSG.net Moderator
RSG.net Moderator


Joined: 11 Jan 2004
Posts: 3310
Location: Perth, Australia

PostPosted: Sun, 14-Sep-2008 9:17    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eulucil wrote:
I think that Bessonova "only" has a 9 written in her DV form


I'm not sure if it was in this topic or another, but IH recently wrote that Anya has 9.9 DV in clubs....
_________________
http://www.youtube.com/Tahnee2612
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail MSN Messenger
Crazy_fan



Joined: 22 Jul 2008
Posts: 215

PostPosted: Sun, 14-Sep-2008 17:25    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eulucil wrote:
Crazy_fan wrote:
Storm wrote:
IH has been kind to use "dancing"... she was not surely referring at Alina expressivity, be sure.


Well, she wasn't dancing and she wasn't sitting on the carpet doing nothing. Wink
She did some elements and someone counted them for something. That someone being the judges...


Yes, most of the times she was running after the hoop... Laughing...


Have you heard the story of the sour grapes?
Well, I wish I could ""run after the hoop"the way Kabaeva did.
_________________
Filipa Siderova- the future of Bulgarian gymnastics!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ybalka_



Joined: 10 Oct 2004
Posts: 1531

PostPosted: Sun, 14-Sep-2008 20:25    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crazy_fan wrote:
Eulucil wrote:
Crazy_fan wrote:
Storm wrote:
IH has been kind to use "dancing"... she was not surely referring at Alina expressivity, be sure.


Well, she wasn't dancing and she wasn't sitting on the carpet doing nothing. Wink
She did some elements and someone counted them for something. That someone being the judges...


Yes, most of the times she was running after the hoop... Laughing...


Have you heard the story of the sour grapes?
Well, I wish I could ""run after the hoop"the way Kabaeva did.


People laughs at kabaevas's routines but I can assure that 100% of gymnast/not gymnast in this forum can't even do the third part of what kabaeva did, even many top gymnast cant. You have only to see how awful backscales pivots are done today even thos of kanaeva or garaeva, which I consider to be the "best" nowadays.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Marts85



Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Posts: 634
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Sun, 14-Sep-2008 22:20    Post subject: Reply with quote

ybalka_ wrote:
Crazy_fan wrote:
Eulucil wrote:
Crazy_fan wrote:
Storm wrote:
IH has been kind to use "dancing"... she was not surely referring at Alina expressivity, be sure.


Well, she wasn't dancing and she wasn't sitting on the carpet doing nothing. Wink
She did some elements and someone counted them for something. That someone being the judges...


Yes, most of the times she was running after the hoop... Laughing...


Have you heard the story of the sour grapes?
Well, I wish I could ""run after the hoop"the way Kabaeva did.


People laughs at kabaevas's routines but I can assure that 100% of gymnast/not gymnast in this forum can't even do the third part of what kabaeva did, even many top gymnast cant. You have only to see how awful backscales pivots are done today even thos of kanaeva or garaeva, which I consider to be the "best" nowadays.


i agree with you that if you watch osaka 99, none of the gymnasts of today could do the kabaeva's routines, but in the end of her career she seemed to me a bit obstinate even if a always like her way of performing
_________________
And she stood in that regal, yet beautifully defiant, pose and waited for her music to start.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
CoCoNuTsiopatHic



Joined: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 821

PostPosted: Thu, 18-Sep-2008 2:24    Post subject: Reply with quote

Invisible Hedgehog wrote:

I want to see Kanaeva's if you were that harsh to Bessonova


EVGENIYA KANAEVA, RUS – CLUBS

Difficulty:

1. L – Stag jeté w/ arch = 0.6
2. F – Back scale w/ 360 degree turn (No value—Rotation began before fixation)
3. B – Back split w/ help = 0.3 (No value—Second technical movement began after fixation)
4. B – Side scale w/ split w/ trunk at horizontal = 0.5
5. P – Ring w/o help 360 w/ shape change to Back split w/ help 360 (No value—Loss of balance)
6. B – Front scale w/ split w/ trunk at horizontal = 0.5
7. B – Back split w/ help w/ 360 degree slow turn = 0.7
8. B – Back scale w/ trunk at horizontal = 0.5
9. F – Back scale w/ 360 degree turn from the floor = 0.9
10. B – Side split w/o help = 0.3
11. B – Attitude = 0.2
12. B – Front split w/o help = 0.3
13. B – Ring on shoulder w/o help w/ 360 degree slow turn = 0.8
14. L – Split jeté w/ arch = 0.6
15. B – Ring w/o help = 0.5
16. B – Front split w/ help w/ ½ turn of trunk = 0.5 (No value—Rotation of trunk not complete with fixation)
17. P – Ring w/ help 720 = 0.5

Difficulty total = 6.900


CAP:

1. Large throw: Asymmetric + Both clubs + Leap + Rotation = 0.4
2. Catch: Rotation = 0.1
3. Handling: Difficulty (0.2) = 0.2
4. Mills (0.1): Difficulty = 0.3
5. Mills: Series + Rhythmic steps + Rotation = 0.4
6. Handling: Rhythmic steps = 0.1 (No credit—Circle incomplete; Free rotation after steps)
7. Handling: Without hands = 0.1
8. Small throw: Under leg + Outside visual field = 0.1
9. Mills: Difficulty = 0.3
10. Handling: Difficulty = 0.2
11. Mills: Difficulty = 0.3
12. Large throw: Leap + Both clubs = 0.2
13. Catch: Two dynamic elements (0.2) + On floor + Both clubs = 0.4
14. Handling: On floor w/ loss of contact + Without hands = 0.2
15. Small throw: Without hands + On floor = 0.1
16. Mills: Difficulty = 0.3
17. Asymmetric movements: Difficulty = 0.2
18. Mills: Difficulty = 0.3 (No credit—Alternation of circles not shown; Note: Could be planned as “Small circles” which is fully acceptable but has no CAP value)
19. Mills: Series + Rhythmic steps + Rotation + Change of plane = 0.5
20. Asymmetric movements: Difficulty = 0.2
21. Large throw: Leap + Both clubs = 0.2
22. Catch: Leap + Rotation + Outside visual field + Both clubs = 0.4
23. Large throw: Difficulty + Asymmetric + Both clubs = 0.4
24. Small throw: Without hands + Outside visual field = 0.1
25. Mills: Total body wave (0.2) + Series + Change of plane = 0.5
26. Large throw: Cascade + Both clubs = 0.2
27. Catch: Two dynamic elements + On the floor + Both clubs = 0.4

CAP total = 6.700

Basic Composition

Music: 0.800

-0.1 – Absence of harmony in the character of each sequence of movements
-0.1 – Absence of harmony in the character of each sequence of movements

Choreography: 1.400

-0.3 – Statism of the apparatus
-0.1 – Insufficient variety in the use of the body
-0.1 – Absence of the variety of the dynamics
-0.1 – Absence of the variety in the use of space: modes

Artistic total = 8.900


Execution:

1D – Lack of amplitude in the shape: -0.1
2D – Incomplete movement: -0.1
5D – Incorrectly held body segment: -0.1
5D – Axis of body not at vertical; one step: -0.3
7D – Incorrectly held body segment: -0.1
7D – Incomplete movement: -0.1
9D – Incomplete movement: -0.1
15D – Incorrectly held body segment: -0.1
16D – Incomplete movement: -0.1

Execution total = 8.900

Composition total = 7.900

TOTAL SCORE: 16.800
_________________
*Elegance is an attitude.*
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Marts85



Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Posts: 634
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Thu, 18-Sep-2008 9:36    Post subject: Reply with quote

wow... it is like more than 2 points less than her real mark.. it's unexplainable
_________________
And she stood in that regal, yet beautifully defiant, pose and waited for her music to start.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Hooby



Joined: 07 Nov 2007
Posts: 870

PostPosted: Sun, 21-Sep-2008 13:49    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
1. L – Stag jeté w/ arch = 0.6
According to what CoCoNuTsIoPaThIc, can someone tell me what "L" is and what Jete` in general is? They say that it is a leap in ballet but I can't figure out how it looks like. I watched Zhenya's clubs routine and I saw the stage leap but where's the jete`? Does it differ even from a leap:watch:


_________________
*Don't ever let someone tell you that you can't do something.You got a dream, you got to protect it. People can’t do something themselves, they want to tell you that you can’t do it. You want something, go get it.


Last edited by Hooby on Sun, 21-Sep-2008 19:02; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Janita



Joined: 06 Apr 2004
Posts: 2893

PostPosted: Sun, 21-Sep-2008 14:39    Post subject: Reply with quote

hooby,

in here "L" = leap, F = flexibility, B = balance, P = pivot at least this i pressume.

the jete stands for the "turn" she is making just before the jump. Normally we say "jete en tournant"

i hope it helps
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ivan



Joined: 13 Apr 2004
Posts: 840
Location: Milky Way Galaxy

PostPosted: Sun, 21-Sep-2008 16:08    Post subject: Reply with quote

CoCoNuTsiopatHic wrote:
Invisible Hedgehog wrote:

I want to see Kanaeva's if you were that harsh to Bessonova


EVGENIYA KANAEVA, RUS – CLUBS

Difficulty:

1. L – Stag jeté w/ arch = 0.6
2. F – Back scale w/ 360 degree turn (No value—Rotation began before fixation)
3. B – Back split w/ help = 0.3 (No value—Second technical movement began after fixation)
4. B – Side scale w/ split w/ trunk at horizontal = 0.5
5. P – Ring w/o help 360 w/ shape change to Back split w/ help 360 (No value—Loss of balance)
6. B – Front scale w/ split w/ trunk at horizontal = 0.5
7. B – Back split w/ help w/ 360 degree slow turn = 0.7
8. B – Back scale w/ trunk at horizontal = 0.5
9. F – Back scale w/ 360 degree turn from the floor = 0.9
10. B – Side split w/o help = 0.3
11. B – Attitude = 0.2
12. B – Front split w/o help = 0.3
13. B – Ring on shoulder w/o help w/ 360 degree slow turn = 0.8
14. L – Split jeté w/ arch = 0.6
15. B – Ring w/o help = 0.5
16. B – Front split w/ help w/ ½ turn of trunk = 0.5 (No value—Rotation of trunk not complete with fixation)
17. P – Ring w/ help 720 = 0.5

Difficulty total = 6.900


CAP:

1. Large throw: Asymmetric + Both clubs + Leap + Rotation = 0.4
2. Catch: Rotation = 0.1
3. Handling: Difficulty (0.2) = 0.2
4. Mills (0.1): Difficulty = 0.3
5. Mills: Series + Rhythmic steps + Rotation = 0.4
6. Handling: Rhythmic steps = 0.1 (No credit—Circle incomplete; Free rotation after steps)
7. Handling: Without hands = 0.1
8. Small throw: Under leg + Outside visual field = 0.1
9. Mills: Difficulty = 0.3
10. Handling: Difficulty = 0.2
11. Mills: Difficulty = 0.3
12. Large throw: Leap + Both clubs = 0.2
13. Catch: Two dynamic elements (0.2) + On floor + Both clubs = 0.4
14. Handling: On floor w/ loss of contact + Without hands = 0.2
15. Small throw: Without hands + On floor = 0.1
16. Mills: Difficulty = 0.3
17. Asymmetric movements: Difficulty = 0.2
18. Mills: Difficulty = 0.3 (No credit—Alternation of circles not shown; Note: Could be planned as “Small circles” which is fully acceptable but has no CAP value)
19. Mills: Series + Rhythmic steps + Rotation + Change of plane = 0.5
20. Asymmetric movements: Difficulty = 0.2
21. Large throw: Leap + Both clubs = 0.2
22. Catch: Leap + Rotation + Outside visual field + Both clubs = 0.4
23. Large throw: Difficulty + Asymmetric + Both clubs = 0.4
24. Small throw: Without hands + Outside visual field = 0.1
25. Mills: Total body wave (0.2) + Series + Change of plane = 0.5
26. Large throw: Cascade + Both clubs = 0.2
27. Catch: Two dynamic elements + On the floor + Both clubs = 0.4

CAP total = 6.700

Basic Composition

Music: 0.800

-0.1 – Absence of harmony in the character of each sequence of movements
-0.1 – Absence of harmony in the character of each sequence of movements

Choreography: 1.400

-0.3 – Statism of the apparatus
-0.1 – Insufficient variety in the use of the body
-0.1 – Absence of the variety of the dynamics
-0.1 – Absence of the variety in the use of space: modes

Artistic total = 8.900


Execution:

1D – Lack of amplitude in the shape: -0.1
2D – Incomplete movement: -0.1
5D – Incorrectly held body segment: -0.1
5D – Axis of body not at vertical; one step: -0.3
7D – Incorrectly held body segment: -0.1
7D – Incomplete movement: -0.1
9D – Incomplete movement: -0.1
15D – Incorrectly held body segment: -0.1
16D – Incomplete movement: -0.1

Execution total = 8.900

Composition total = 7.900

TOTAL SCORE: 16.800


Well,
this is according to you Smile))
Why do you think that you are correct?
According to real judges, you are not correct.
Whom to trust - to you or to the certified by FIG ones ?
Cheers Smile)))
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Jonathan



Joined: 26 Oct 2003
Posts: 2185
Location: Paris

PostPosted: Sun, 21-Sep-2008 16:18    Post subject: Reply with quote

ivan wrote:
Whom to trust - to you or to the certified by FIG ones ?
Cheers Smile)))


The ones drinking vodka like water!
_________________
Jon
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
CoCoNuTsiopatHic



Joined: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 821

PostPosted: Sun, 21-Sep-2008 18:43    Post subject: Reply with quote

ivan wrote:


Well,
this is according to you Smile))
Why do you think that you are correct?
According to real judges, you are not correct.
Whom to trust - to you or to the certified by FIG ones ?
Cheers Smile)))


I list every element, I identify every deduction I take, I give the reason for not crediting an element. I substantiate my analysis. I don't just post "Well I got a ___ for Difficulty" and leave it at that. I try to make my analysis clear like this so that people are able to respond and say that they disagree with a particular deduction as Invisible Hedgehog did upthread. Ivan, if you see deductions I took that you disagree with, then feel free to say so, but I would hope you'd try to substantiate your position just as I have tried to do.

I feel that I am only as strict as the Code of Points says to be.
_________________
*Elegance is an attitude.*
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Rhythmic Gymnastics Forum Index » Code of Points All times are GMT + 1 Hour
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next
Page 6 of 8

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum



Contents | Information | Events and Results | Gymnasts | Archive

last Modified: 25. October 2003

Copyright © 1996-2010 Alexander Kochann