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2009-2012 COP Ball
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Anna Kull



Joined: 27 Oct 2003
Posts: 5153
Location: Switzerland

PostPosted: Sat, 20-Dec-2008 8:38    Post subject: 2009-2012 COP Ball Reply with quote

As the general topic grew to big we decided to create a few. To start with I create the ones per appartus now
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Anyen93



Joined: 29 Feb 2008
Posts: 707
Location: Prague,CZE

PostPosted: Thu, 25-Dec-2008 14:29    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please could anyone send me the simplest examples of risks with and without throw??(for ball only)
Thanks
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Themis



Joined: 02 Jan 2005
Posts: 370

PostPosted: Fri, 26-Dec-2008 2:33    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most likely throw + walkover+ catch during a second walkover. Or if the gymnast is quick two rolls to catch with feet immediately at the end.
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Anyen93



Joined: 29 Feb 2008
Posts: 707
Location: Prague,CZE

PostPosted: Sat, 27-Dec-2008 11:08    Post subject: Reply with quote

Themis wrote:
Most likely throw + walkover+ catch during a second walkover. Or if the gymnast is quick two rolls to catch with feet immediately at the end.

Thanks
Please could anyone send some examples of risk WITHOUT throw??
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Marts85



Joined: 20 Jul 2008
Posts: 634
Location: Italy

PostPosted: Wed, 31-Dec-2008 1:13    Post subject: Reply with quote

i am quoting from the topic about risks:
Quote:
The element Bessonova performed here with the ball at 0:19 would be a Risk without throw. --> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8y1wTFMgmg

0.3 for the base, and *I think* she gets the extra +0.1 for "passing on the floor", though I'm not totally sure what that means. That means if the body rotation travels, right? It doesn't mean a passing of the apparatus, correct?

Additional Mastery value that would apply:
Bouncing: Without hands = 0.1
Large roll: Without hands + Rotation + Flexibility = 0.3

So the whole thing is worth either 0.7 or 0.8.

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Anyen93



Joined: 29 Feb 2008
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Location: Prague,CZE

PostPosted: Wed, 31-Dec-2008 11:47    Post subject: Reply with quote

Marts85 wrote:
i am quoting from the topic about risks:
Quote:
The element Bessonova performed here with the ball at 0:19 would be a Risk without throw. --> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8y1wTFMgmg

0.3 for the base, and *I think* she gets the extra +0.1 for "passing on the floor", though I'm not totally sure what that means. That means if the body rotation travels, right? It doesn't mean a passing of the apparatus, correct?

Additional Mastery value that would apply:
Bouncing: Without hands = 0.1
Large roll: Without hands + Rotation + Flexibility = 0.3

So the whole thing is worth either 0.7 or 0.8.

thanks
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CoCoNuTsiopatHic



Joined: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 819

PostPosted: Wed, 31-Dec-2008 21:02    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does anyone think it's possible to do a roll of the ball across the arms and chest in a Backwards Illusion turn? If so, it'd count as a "Risk without throw".

At the 1992 Euros, Oksana Skaldina performed a small roll of the ball on her back during a Forward Illusion turn, but it was never a stable element for her, and I'm not sure if a gymnast could make it a large roll.
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cidlover



Joined: 07 Dec 2008
Posts: 862
Location: USA

PostPosted: Thu, 1-Jan-2009 5:57    Post subject: Reply with quote

CoCoNuTsiopatHic wrote:
Does anyone think it's possible to do a roll of the ball across the arms and chest in a Backwards Illusion turn? If so, it'd count as a "Risk without throw".

At the 1992 Euros, Oksana Skaldina performed a small roll of the ball on her back during a Forward Illusion turn, but it was never a stable element for her, and I'm not sure if a gymnast could make it a large roll.


Would that also get credit for being an originality?
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CoCoNuTsiopatHic



Joined: 14 Apr 2006
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PostPosted: Thu, 1-Jan-2009 6:20    Post subject: Reply with quote

cidlover wrote:
CoCoNuTsiopatHic wrote:
Does anyone think it's possible to do a roll of the ball across the arms and chest in a Backwards Illusion turn? If so, it'd count as a "Risk without throw".

At the 1992 Euros, Oksana Skaldina performed a small roll of the ball on her back during a Forward Illusion turn, but it was never a stable element for her, and I'm not sure if a gymnast could make it a large roll.


Would that also get credit for being an originality?


Yeah, as far as I know it would.
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Iva



Joined: 31 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Wed, 21-Jan-2009 17:40    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyen93 wrote:

Please could anyone send some examples of risk WITHOUT throw??


large roll, no hands, on walkover backwards = 0.3
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Invisible Hedgehog



Joined: 27 Oct 2003
Posts: 1718
Location: Ukraine, Kyiv

PostPosted: Sat, 24-Jan-2009 19:12    Post subject: Reply with quote

Marts85 wrote:
i am quoting from the topic about risks:
Quote:
The element Bessonova performed here with the ball at 0:19 would be a Risk without throw. --> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8y1wTFMgmg

0.3 for the base, and *I think* she gets the extra +0.1 for "passing on the floor", though I'm not totally sure what that means. That means if the body rotation travels, right? It doesn't mean a passing of the apparatus, correct?

Additional Mastery value that would apply:
Bouncing: Without hands = 0.1
Large roll: Without hands + Rotation + Flexibility = 0.3

So the whole thing is worth either 0.7 or 0.8.


hm, of course, it is a risk what bessonova does here but your calculation is weird.
Where here is passing on the floor? She does not pass on the floor, if her hand touches the floor during the walkover backwards, it does not mean that she touches the floor.
You cannot add here the mastery without throw which is already included in the risk! This risk already includes that the roll should be during rotation.
The whole thing for Bessonova could be :

Bouncing without hands (I am in fact not really sure for this, but let's think that her catch without hands) 0.10
Risk 0.30
you can add here +0.10 for flexibility and +0.10 for flexibility (in fact the whole roll is done during rotation which is part of flexibility...) Well, hell knows really.

So it should be 0.60
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Attitude



Joined: 22 Apr 2006
Posts: 103

PostPosted: Sun, 25-Jan-2009 18:22    Post subject: Reply with quote

Flexibility 33 E:

If you do large roll during this element:

can you add change of plane-symbol, because gymnast changes level ( from floor to standing position) ?

cop: page 78: change of plane , level, direction or rhythm of the apparatus or gymnast

and can you add outside visual field, if back scale is performed very well?
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Marie



Joined: 26 Oct 2003
Posts: 1293

PostPosted: Tue, 27-Jan-2009 21:02    Post subject: Reply with quote

Attitude wrote:
Flexibility 33 E:

If you do large roll during this element:

can you add change of plane-symbol, because gymnast changes level ( from floor to standing position) ?

cop: page 78: change of plane , level, direction or rhythm of the apparatus or gymnast


According to the text in the COP, I would say yes. I can't think of other elements that would comprise a much larger change in level of the gymnast. It might make more sense to use that criterion only for the apparatus, not for the gymnast. But the COP does not make any difference between body and apparatus.

Attitude wrote:
and can you add outside visual field, if back scale is performed very well?


According to the drawings in errata "corrections formelles", page 2, I would say no. Elements without throw should be performed on the back side of the body, not the front side.
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Attitude



Joined: 22 Apr 2006
Posts: 103

PostPosted: Tue, 27-Jan-2009 22:09    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks !!!
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grga



Joined: 08 Oct 2007
Posts: 33
Location: Gibraltar

PostPosted: Thu, 5-Feb-2009 20:38    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi when doing a log roll ,if i want to roll the ball does it have to roll twice??
thanks
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